Curse

Skint · Mar 12, 2008, 05:21 PM // 17:21

I haven't tested this build yet, I was just wondering whether it would be viable and therefore worth using. thanks

[skill]Barbed Spear[/skill][wiki]Maiming Spear[/wiki][skill]Extend Conditions[/skill][skill]Epidemic[/skill][card]Aggressive Refrain[/card][skill]Ether Signet[/skill][skill]Anthem Of Flame[/skill][skill]Signet Of Return[/skill]

Leardership - 10 + 1 + 1
Spear Mastery - 10 + 1
Inspiration Magic - 11

Useage:

First use aggresive refrain then ether signet to regain energy. Target enemy in middle of a mob. when you have enough adrenaline use barbed spear, maiming spear, extend conditions and epidemic. That should spread conditions to the rest of the mob. Use Anthem of Flame to reapply AR then repeat the process.

Counters:

Condition Removal
Blindness
Plague Touch
Immunity to Bleeding
Scattering

ps. can't get maiming spear icon to work :S

Updated Variants

See my later posts for commentry on them:

Leardership - 10 + 1 + 1
Motivaton - 10 + 1
Inspiration Magic - 11

or

Leadership - 12 + 1 + 1
Inspiration Magic - 12

[wiki]"You Move Like a Dwarf!"[/wiki][skill]Awe[/skill][skill]Extend Conditions[/skill][skill]Epidemic[/skill][card]Aggressive Refrain[/card][skill]Ether Signet[/skill][skill]Signet Of Return[/skill]
+ Leadership/Motivation Chant or Shout of choice depending on whether or not you put points into motivatoin (preferably with a short recharge so you can use to refresh AR)

Leardership - 10 + 1 + 1
Spear Mastery - 10 + 1
Inspiration Magic - 11

[skill]Slayer's Spear[/skill][skill]Merciless Spear[/skill][skill]Extend Conditions[/skill][skill]Epidemic[/skill][card]Aggressive Refrain[/card][skill]Ether Signet[/skill][skill]Anthem Of Flame[/skill][skill]Signet Of Return[/skill]

African War Lord · Mar 12, 2008, 05:28 PM // 17:28

creative yes. worthwhile no.

Angels Guidance · Mar 12, 2008, 05:30 PM // 17:30

Hmmm, good concept, would love to see extend being used more often, yet due to epidemics 'adjacent' range it maybe be less effective vs mixed groups of casters + melee. Also ether signet wouldnt be necessary, maybe blazing spear instead?

Richardt · Mar 12, 2008, 05:40 PM // 17:40

The only that concerns me is lack of a shield. And there are no adrenal shouts to maintain energy. Are you using an Inspiration offhand?

I like the concept-very creative, I'm concerned about the practical implementation.

Skint · Mar 12, 2008, 05:49 PM // 17:49

hmmm, I was basing the skills of gw wiki and there it says Extend Conditions is only a 5 sec recharge, barbed spear is 2 adrenaline and ether signet only 45 sec recharge. which is more likely to be right?

If EC is only 5 sec recharge there'd be no need for a mes offhand, probably better off with a shield even if it's only half armour.

The problem with the energy shouts is that they're motivation which would weaken the point pool. Could use a skill like leech signet or power drain with lower recharges so you can have quicker fixes of energy but i'm not great with interrupts

thanks for the feedback anyway

majikmajikmajik · Mar 12, 2008, 06:54 PM // 18:54

perhaps a full condition bar for para and a extend mesmer with interrupts

- Tain - · Mar 12, 2008, 07:06 PM // 19:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skint

I haven't tested this build yet, I was just wondering whether it would be viable and therefore worth using. thanks

[skill]Barbed Spear[/skill][skill]Maiming Spear[/skill][skill]Extend Conditions[/skill][skill]Epidemic[/skill][card]Aggressive Refrain[/card][skill]Ether Signet[/skill][skill]Anthem Of Flame[/skill][skill]Signet Of Return[/skill]

GJ trying to use Extend, but meh... Barbed + Maiming is already wickedly spammable - the problem is that these aren't strong conditions to spread. Bleeding is weak alone, but obviously needed to trigger Maiming. Cripple is strong in pvp, and on leaks if you're running a squishy backline in pve. Dazed and Blind, and to some extent Deep Wound, are things you want to spread around, and other things than paras are better at that.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skint

hmmm, I was basing the skills of gw wiki and there it says Extend Conditions is only a 5 sec recharge, barbed spear is 2 adrenaline and ether signet only 45 sec recharge. which is more likely to be right?

Wiki is correct.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skint

If EC is only 5 sec recharge there'd be no need for a mes offhand, probably better off with a shield even if it's only half armour.

Shield ftw - Leadership is energy management out the wazoo, make use of it. Bring a staff for casting AR if you get DP'd.

Lopezus · Mar 12, 2008, 07:22 PM // 19:22

in PvE i would use Signet of Infection : Barbed Spear for bledeing, Signet of Infection for Diseased, extend condition,epidemic :could be interesting.

- Tain - · Mar 12, 2008, 07:26 PM // 19:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lopezus

in PvE i would use Signet of Infection : Barbed Spear for bledeing, Signet of Infection for Diseased, extend condition,epidemic :could be interesting.

Disease spreads itself, and like I said there is no need to use an elite to make ultra-spammable conditions last longer.

Skint · Mar 12, 2008, 07:38 PM // 19:38

could try some of these combinations instead of barbed and maiming

[skill]"You Move Like a Dwarf!"[/skill][skill]Awe[/skill]

spreads daze and cripple (esp as a bug means the crippling affect the foe as soon as knock-down, not when they get up), problem with half-range though and you would need keep ether signet so you can use the skills straight after AR. PvE only and long recharges are the downfall. Though I suppose if you were quick enough and had Inspiration magic of 12 you could make the conditions last even longer by switching targets after epidemic, casting EC and Epidemic again, doubling the few seconds left of daze and buying enough time so you can fire of the first two skills again without much delay

Infact, you wouldn't need any points in spear mastery, you could put them into motivation for full armour of the shield, and use a more useful shout than Anthem of Flame. You'd sacrifice the damage from the spear but could use an inspiration wand instead

[skill]Slayer's Spear[/skill][skill]Merciless Spear[/skill]

spreads knock-down. Depends on health of monster, and problematic when first attacking as poor gauge on health relationship when using SS. though, if it's your first attack you may as well attempt it to a) see if enemy has more health then you, b) cause damage to get them down to half-health. Sup runes may be useful to a degree

One thing about this build is that you can syngerise with other players. If you're calling the targets you can have other players inflicting the deep wounds, blindness, etc on the target and then you spread it around. Admittedly a SF ele can spread burning a lot better (esp as burning with most other skills is too short to effectively be spread by epidemic), however the extend condition could be used to keep foes burning for longer allowing SF to do more damage. Working with an SF ele would allow you to get maximum use out of "they're on fire" as well, serving a double purpose of refreshing AR as well

Antithesis · Mar 12, 2008, 10:28 PM // 22:28

I take Epidemic on a Stunning Strike bar to spread Dazed. I've been trying to get an Ebon spearhead for Ebon Dust Aura to spread blind in a Paragon tandem ie Paragon 1 hits with dazed, Paragon 2 hits with Blind, Paragon 1 spreads either or both to adjacent foes. Heroes don't seem to use EDA very well (tried a hero R/D EDA Volleyer with an Ebon bow, didn't perform to expectations) so it may be a failed experiment. Unless you're spreading heavy-hitting conditions like these, i don't see the point.

Instead of Extend Conditions, Ether Signet and Epidemic, I'd rather use Hypochondria to load up a target with conditions and Fevered Dreams to spread those conditions area-wide. Hypochondria is pointless if calling a target, i'd take it only on a self-targetting hero. If you combine this with a BHA/Stunning Striker and an Ele Blindbot you can spread Dazed, Cracked Armor, Blind and Weakness pretty easily. A Para can already toss Bleeding, Burning and Deep Wound around, there's no real need for a dedicated condition spreader just for these.

Nice try but Extend Conditions and Ether Signet are wasted on a Paragon bar. Keep Epidemic for the same results.

BTW - An SF is already perma-burning foes by spamming SF every 2 secs. Unless you can spread that to the area, there's no synergy with Extend Conditions. And SF is fail in HM against higher armor foes, that team spot is better filled with something other than a fire ele.

- Tain - · Mar 12, 2008, 10:41 PM // 22:41

The real thing is that most conditions are pointless to Extend - that's the flaw of the skill, and what makes it a less valuable elite. Epidemic can be great in pve where things tend to group up, such as with B-Flash on the huge mob of warriors in Gyala Hatchery. In general, though, it's wasteful to bring an elite to extend your conditions' durations when you can just reapply them.

Shaz · Mar 12, 2008, 11:12 PM // 23:12

What Tain said, spending your elite to just extend condition that's already last quite a long time and spammable is quite useless. Put Stunning in there to add dazed into the mix. That said though, condition pressure in PvE is pretty pointless imo. In PvE you'd want to spike thing out and get it down as soon as possible. But if I want to spread condition, I would probably take a trapper instead in PvE.

Antithesis · Mar 12, 2008, 11:17 PM // 23:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shaz

That said though, condition pressure in PvE is pretty pointless imo.

I think that sums it up nicely in a nutshell. Dazed is good but not needed on casters. Blind and Weakness is good but not needed on a melee train. All other conditions are a minor damage bonus.

Skint · Mar 12, 2008, 11:22 PM // 23:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by - Tain -

The real thing is that most conditions are pointless to Extend - that's the flaw of the skill, and what makes it a less valuable elite. Epidemic can be great in pve where things tend to group up, such as with B-Flash on the huge mob of warriors in Gyala Hatchery. In general, though, it's wasteful to bring an elite to extend your conditions' durations when you can just reapply them.

good point, thought awe was a 20sec recharge. damn the confusion between the skill icons and wiki

in that case, would it be better to use [skill]Ineptitude[/skill] or [skill]Fevered Dreams[/skill] as elites? Obvioulsy you wouldn't need Epidemic with FD, therefore you can use another Condition skill. As illusion magic signet will go. Will probably need a motivation chant/skill that gives energy though such as [skill]Zealous Anthem[/skill], or [skill]Leader's Zeal[/skill] or a radiant armour set.

At least this way you can spread dazed around without needing an elite or having to rely on good timing, and with ineptitude you can pretty much shut down casters and melee for a short period of time. The only problem might be energy management

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shaz

That said though, condition pressure in PvE is pretty pointless imo.

Could run a PvP build around stunning strike in that case (don't know if it's been done before)

[wiki]Signet of Agression[/wiki][card]"Make Your Time!"[/card][skill]Barbed Spear[/skill][skill]Stunning Strike[/skill][skill]Epidemic[/skill][card]Aggressive Refrain[/card][skill]Anthem Of Flame[/skill][skill]Signet Of Return[/skill]

AR, then SoA and MYT before battle to get your adrenaline ASAP. Barbed Spear to lay down a condition, then Stunning Strike and Epidemic to spread Dazed. AoF to keep up AR. Don't know about energy management but you should be able to constantly keep up Dazed once it's applied. Can also use a spear and shield set. Saying that, it might be easier just to use epidemic and another skill (e.g. BHA) on a different build, don't really know the + and - of using this build against others

(Sorry about all the editing as well. I had already written the first half of the post before I saw the new posts so added more. At least I can call the last build Stunning Epidemic

)

Antithesis · Mar 12, 2008, 11:40 PM // 23:40

If you're a player, i wouldn't take either Ineptitude or Fevered Dreams...Save Yourselves! is too hard to pass up.

Fevered Dreams on a Hero is fun and doesn't need to water down a Paragon's attributes. Recharge on Ineptitude is too long to be used as an AoE blind with Epidemic. Energy management should be fine, just needs another shout on the bar. GFTE is an obvious choice, don't know that i'd take it. Maybe Anthem of Envy instead.

Here's what i'd try for Fevered Dreams - the primary aim is to spread Dazed and Weakness, Deep Wound and Burning are a bonus.

Aggressive Refrain | Fevered Dreams | Spear Swipe | Blazing Spear | Chest Thumper or Merciless Spear | Anthem of Weariness | Anthem of Envy or Go For the Eyes! | Signet of Return

--------------------------------------------------
You should really have Stunning Strike or Broad Head Arrow in your team build and i don't really rate Fevered Dreams - your target's usually dead within 10secs so it feels like a wasted elite. I use this on a Hero -

Aggressive Refrain | Stunning Strike | Blazing Spear | Chest Thumper | Anthem of Weariness | Epidemic | Signet of Return | Optional

I always have either Shell Shock or Weaken Armor in the team build, hence Chest Thumper. Otherwise, take Merciless Spear.
If Epidemic hits...w00t, if it doesn't at least you haven't wasted your elite.

If you want Blind take an Ele Blindbot to spam Blinding Flash or Blinding Surge, Shell Shock and Enervating Charge...toss in Splinter Weapon and Ancestor's Rage for some damage. This team slot should probably be filled with an SS necro instead with Reckless Haste, Enfeebling Blood and Weaken Armor as it'll do the same job but with better AoE and more unconditional damage potential (Barbs, Mark of Pain, Splinter Weapon etc will fit on the bar). Anthem of Weariness isn't needed if taking Enervating Charge or Enfeebling Blood, freeing up another slot on the bar.

Shaz · Mar 13, 2008, 03:14 AM // 03:14

Good job for trying to think outside the box. But your build is just too gimmicky, and gimmick build tend to only work in certain situation. Just keep it simple for a paragon. 2-3 spear attacks, Aggressive Refrain, chant/shout to keep up AR, 1-3 party buffs chant/shout either offensively or defensively, and Signet of Return and you can't go wrong.

Leave the condition spreading to Ele, Ranger, or Necro as they're better at it. The only conditions you should be using in PvE is weakness and maybe cracked armor with the update to Weaken Armor. And to a certain extent, blindness if you have a good way of spreading it and not gimp your team build and damage too much, and sometime dazed. Other conditions, if they're in the build, fine, but don't try to force those in as degeneration is pointless when thing die so quick.

- Tain - · Mar 13, 2008, 03:32 AM // 03:32

Like Shaz said, don't focus too much on the conditions. Most conditions are fairly weak to rely on - degen in particular looks effective when their health bar changes color, but doesn't match up to raw damage. A balanced build is much more efficient; never forget that spear DPS is among the highest, especially since attacking from a range reduces the need to chase down targets.

Also, if you're running Stunning Strike, Anthem of Weariness is a nice addition or alternative to Anthem of Flame. Weakness helps a lot, especially in HM, and it gives a reliable trigger for the Daze.

As far as Deep Wound, I wouldn't touch Slayer's Spear. Too costly and conditional for it to be worthwhile. Merciless spear is effective, and heroes run it well. Vicious Attack is a big winner, especially because of the synergy with "Go for the Eyes!" - a serious energy management skill with Leadership.

Axel Zinfandel · Mar 14, 2008, 04:57 AM // 04:57

If you really want to play around with conditions, try going P/N with Cautery Signet and Plague Sending. You could even bring a N/Me with Foul Feast, Plauge Sending, and Extend conditions

Granted, realistically your enemy should be dispatched by then, but it would work well for tough bosses that spread conditions

xDusT II · Mar 14, 2008, 05:30 AM // 05:30

If you want to play a pseudo-ranger, go ahead. But forfeiting the huge potential of a paragon class to create a largely inefficient version of a ranger is not really worthwhile.